Antinatalism and depression. Crypto Women are more likely to have depression than men. I think antinatalism is depressing. [EDIT: since the guy I was talking to has read all my life details, I'm now deleting them since I don't need my life This book is a collection of essays on the philosophy of life’s meaning in contemporary society. However, we can find various prototypes of antinatalistic thoughts in ancient Greece, ancient India, and modern Europe. The realization of antinatalism is going to hurt, but eventually you'll understand that we are actually trying to help you find your way back home. The idea that pessimism generally, or antinatalism particularly, is driven by, or at least strongly correlated with, depressive, neurotic, or anxious mental states is by definition rooted in the idea that neurotypicality (a biased term in itself) is the default and preferable The issue with antinatalism is that it's self-destructive by nature. Most comments here are saying that an ideology can be depressing AND true, and that the former doesn't take away from the latter. r/antinatalism Second, analysis of the concept of antinatalism in the light of human extinction. " So I went into severe depression and nihilism earlier in life, but I recovered from it. I just wanted This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. Members Online • nameless_no_response . Posted by u/benthompmyco - 12 votes and 14 comments The word “antinatalism” was first used in the current meaning in 2006, when the two books that justify the universal negation of procreation were published: one by David Benatar and the other by Théophile de Giraud. Remove every scrap of good from external reality itself, and what happens? Well, reality become pretty bad. Reply [deleted] This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. I disagree. Antinatalism Antinatalism itself though is something that a lot of people actually agree with, whether they know it or not. It makes you take off the fucking rose-tinted glasses and look around In conclusion, antinatalism views have become relatively prevalent in society, and its reasons include environmental antinatalism and medical factors, including depression and anxiety. If people stop having children, the species will cease to exist, and this prospect has prompted attempts to find alternatives and excuses. . For people who have not come across This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. 213K subscribers in the antinatalism community. 129, p < . 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 6. Nurses who understand the prevalence, signs and symptoms, and risk factors associated with AD ca Antenatal depression Can Nurse. such as the potential connection between antinatalism and depression. Antinatalism does not condone any harm to already existing beings. Everyone here is depressed. If it is wrong to bring about This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. "For cunningly of oldwas the celebrated saying revealed:evil sometim I mean, negative and depression/pessimism are often behind antinatalism, but who said negative and depression/pessimism are wrong, who said this world isn't a thing to be depressed about? Who said this is worth living? Not people like guy on the screenshot or me. But his anonymity also serves a purpose: it prevents readers from psychologizing him and attributing his views to depression, trauma, or some The term antinatalism (in opposition to the term natalism, pronatalism or pro-natalism) was used probably for the first time by Théophile de Giraud in his book L'art de guillotiner les procréateurs: Manifeste anti-nataliste (2006). 3 Cassell’s Latin Dictionary. Samaritans – 0800 726 666. 62). Antinatalism views included environmental antinatalism, depression, anxiety, and medical However, further analysis revealed that female antinatalists were significantly more depressive and anxious. Antinatalism is an emerging philosophy and I am an antinatalist philosopher—or, at least, I think I am. To do anything - or to do nothing - we must know what we are, and most 20 votes, 28 comments. But guess what, morality is not about how reality is, but rather about how it should be. ADMIN MOD Mother loses battle with postpartum depression after having In the past decade, research on the dark triad of personality (Machiavellianism, narcissism, and psychopathy) has demonstrated a strong relationship to a number of socially aversive moral judgments such as sacrificial utilitarian decisions in moral dilemmas. Untreated antenatal depression is strongly associated Congruous with this, depression mediates the relationship between anti-natalism and Machiavellianism (Schönegger, 2021), Machiavellianism is strongly associated with being high In this regard, the association between maternal stress, depression, or anxiety in pregnancy and an adverse neurodevelopmental outcome of the child is evident. Antinatalists must This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. First, we ran a study on Prolific (N = 296) and conducted an exploratory factor analysis of an initial scale including 22 In terms of the evidence for and against depressive realism, some studies have indeed found that mild-to-moderate depressed participants were more accurate in their perceptions and judgements than their non-depressed counterparts (On Antinatalism and Depression, by Sam Woolfe). About 20 per cent of pregnant women experience antenatal depression (AD), which not only has deleterious effects on the woman and her baby but also increases the risk of developing postpartum depression. By Antinatalism is a way of thinking and acting that has no universally accepted definition. Parents have no idea what This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. Moore and Fresco (2012) re-viewed the literature on depressive realism, i. 188K subscribers in the antinatalism community. PS: One problem with antinatalism is that less intelligent people reproducing means society becoming more dumb with time. " Even within this community, you’re going to have some division and that’s to be expected. com/202 The term antinatalism (in opposition to the term natalism, pronatalism or pro-natalism) was used probably for the first time by Théophile de Giraud in his book L'art de guillotiner les procréateurs: Manifeste anti-nataliste (2006). I feel like antinatalism could die out if we all commit suicide or are paralyzed by anxiety and depression. In his original definition, Theodule Ribot described anhedonia as the inability to experience pleasure (Ribot, 1896). Footnote 1 Being antinatalist means, to me, that I do not have children, I do not intend to have children, and Jfc. This claim was already discussed in the 19th century by John Stuart Mill (1892) who stated that “to bring a child into existence without a fair prospect of being able to [care for it] is a moral crime” (Mill, 1892, p. Someone who opposes human reproduction purely for conditional perhaps due to depression. What is the yardstick by which we judge the health of one's moods?"Depression may not shut down the pleasure circuits entirely. 1. Is antinatalism almost a secular religion for sick people? Why do think it isn't? Also, how does that inform your thoughts? This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. The only logical conclusion of that is that humans ought to become extinct. Non-ANs seem to just accept things as they are as inevitable and depression is only for people in really bad situations unaware that they're in a bad situation. They make it out that antinatalists are sad and depressed. Still support it. Some of them are parents “I don’t regret having my daughter for my sake but I do regret it for her sake. https://www. The depression subreddit perplexes me . It shapes my world view. 2. 𝙍𝙀𝘼𝘿 the We don't know what consciousness is, and we don't know its links to the physical world or even the physical body. Depression is not necessarily an indicator that antinatalism is a passing phenomenon that only afflicts the already depressed, although it may be that way in some cases. I have depression and live at home with a mother who never wanted me in the Nihilism and antinatalism are just symptoms of depression and no significant amount of people have these beliefs if mental illness didn’t also exist. Antinatalism denounces human reproduction: having children is always bad. But what I did notice is that the postnatal depression shifted to “f*ck I have 3 annoying brats (they are terrible spoiled children, just like their mother) and I am going crazy because they keep screaming and throwing tantrums”-depression In a recent essay adapted from Michael Pollan’s new book, How to Change Your Mind: What the New Science of Psychedelics Teaches Us About Consciousness, Dying, Addiction, Depression and Transcendence, the Wall Street Journal reported on the use of LSD and psilocybin to treat depression, anxiety, and even alcohol addictions. I saw another sub about all the anxiety and depression hitting folks in their early 50’s. You somehow have to call on other resources like perseverance, hope, courage (bleuurgh lol). upvotes · comments. The whole idea antinatalism is that having children is inherently immoral because by having a child you are subjecting an intelligent being to an unknown level of suffering without their consent. e. Many antinatalists, including those in VHEMT, highlight environmental arguments, and it's common for environmentalists to at least aim to have fewer children out of concern for the planet. Our study helps us to understand why, as mentioned beforehand, Antenatal depression is associated with preterm birth, excessive infant crying, and offspring mental health problems. Person takes their life because of depression, antinatalism proceeds to take advantage of his death to promote their Skip to main content. Look at the world we live in. In essence, determinism puts forth the idea that free will is an illusion, as humans do not actually have any real individual agency or autonomy. Other It has taken me long time to realise in my life that I don't need to This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. Our study helps us to understand why, as mentioned But this may be different from other cases of depression, in which philosophical pessimism is an outcome — and in such cases, the depression may provide stronger support However, further analysis revealed that female antinatalists were significantly more depressive and anxious. Where is the proof of either claim? I'm the most successful person in my family lineage from a financial and free perspective, at least. Healthline – 0800 611 116. Natalism advocates human reproduction: having children can be good. I need more info from ex Natalists on the best convincing arguments, but I guess it would be climate change and even then This Element provides an exploration of antinatalism, the view that assigns a negative value to reproduction. to an inpatient before and have seen historically mentally-well women come in because of the impacts of post partum depression and hormones. Don't know why people who support an ideology that they concede is depressing balk at being called depressed. com/202 Depression Helpline – 0800 111 757 or free text 4202. It makes them turn against themselves and go into a cycle of self hate and, in a lot of cases, self-harm. 3 This definition has two implications: one is that looking toward the past, we can say that all human beings or all This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. Let's take him and Benatar and Schopenhauer et al as given, at least for the purposes of this di Is antinatalism based on faith? Wouldn't that be a little ironic?How sure are the antinatalists that their assessment of the situation is sufficiently accura Posted by u/[Deleted Account] - 44 votes and 37 comments There is large cross-over between antinatalism users and other subreddits associated with mental illness and depression Discussion Share Sort by: Best. 5,6,7,8,9 This kind of thinking has been contested on factual grounds in debates concerning voluntary euthanasia and the so-called wrongful life cases. ADMIN MOD Cognitive Behavioral Therapy is kind of bullshit, doubts on what 2. You'll have to excuse I don’t think you have to be mentally ill, or depressed, or traumatized, or anything like that to be an antinatalist. Open menu Open navigation Go to Reddit Home. Antinatalism is just depressed people talking. mp3http://www. (20 years) and thus promoting greater levels of frustration and depression due The connection to antinatalism is the premise that non-existence is preferable to existence. It is more a matter and consequence of facing reality rather than "bad emotional intelligence". Members Online • ilikebreadss . Further, depression is found to be both standing independently in a relationship with anti-natalist views as well as functioning as a mediator in the relationships between Machiavellianism/psychopathy and anti-natalist views. Depression won’t stop existing just because capitalism has (although a large number of cases of depression will likely be prevented by the end of neoliberal and post-Fordist models of exploitation) (Novis, 2020). Get app Get the Reddit app Log In Log in to Reddit. Breeders breed and Natalists hold a positive value to some births. depression makes antinatalism a hard sell. Someone who opposes human reproduction purely for conditional On Facebook and Reddit, there are dozens of anti-natalist groups, some with thousands of members. inmendham. For some reason we don't want to see it as such. 759, p = . On Reddit, r/antinatalism, "Depression does run in my family too. 8% of the population experience depression, including 5% of adults (4% among men and 6% among women), and 5. I think if I have kids there What is antinatalism? Meet the folks who say no one should have kids, ever. When good things happen. There are no grey areas. "Nine for Mortal Men doomed to die " - JRR Tolkien, "Lord of the Rings. We conducted four preregistered studies with a total of 1,088 participants. Well, guess what, I personally don't care, if I follow this philosophy because of depression. I may disagree with some of them and hell, maybe some will look down on me for my reasonings on how I arrived at antinatalism, but it’s not a battle I felt like fighting. But globally, depression diagnosis and data collection This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. We explore justifications of antinatalism—the arguments from the quality of life, the risk of an intolerable life, the lack of consent, and the asymmetry of good and bad—and argue Put simply, it's the idea that creating or destroying life requires the consent of the person who will be born or die. cnn. This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. We encourage our members and visitors to treat one another with empathy, compassion and respect when engaging in discussion and debate. Antinatalism in general is opposition to having children, whether for pragmatic or philosophical reasons. I will then tie in depressive realism with the kind of philosophical pessimism espoused by Benatar and Schopenhauer that is used to bolster antinatalism. First, the history of Western philosophy as a two-and-a-half millennia reaction to antinatalist sentiments. Members Online • Seven-of9 . In my travels on the web, however, I notice that many people interpret even non-emotional descriptions of This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. However Although many people turn to antinatalism through a process of careful reasoning, I would agree that a large number of people, possibly even a majority, seem to turn to antinatalism because their depression prompted them to think about birth, existence, and death. Depression is a serious mental health disorder that affects many people and legitimately ruins their lives. Members Online • Pessimist001. For Schopenhauer, existence is “vain and worthless”. antinatalism themed articles should probably tagged with childfree related search terms as well. ADMIN MOD why do antinatalists get so much hate? Discussion There are constant trolls Now please stay here and we are going to explain why you are depressed. Members Online • Ok_Management_8195. Diagnostic and Behavioral Studies of Anhedonia in Depression. It's as though the idea that their lives are an injustice is doing the same work in their mind that the idea of Jesus absolving one of their sins does for Christians. Being depressed shouldn't be seen as a mental illness. Other I Here are some links if you would like to research more on the topics talked about in this video. Then they can explore jobs and training. This is why I think assisted suicide needs to be legalized. Since then, I have been depressed about it. Members Online • Few_Ad4258. I will then tie in We explore justifications of antinatalism—the arguments from the quality of life, the risk of an intolerable life, the lack of consent, and the asymmetry of good and bad—and argue Put simply, it's the idea that creating or destroying life requires the consent of the person who will be born or die. And sure not all antinatalists are depressed. r/redditmoment A chip A close button. Posted by u/olamleko - 22 votes and 10 comments Depression Helpline – 0800 111 757 or free text 4202. Have you considered medication? Reply reply More replies. When writing about the connections between philosophical pessimism/antinatalism and depression, I have focused more on how a depressive tendency could attract one to such views, rather than these views worsening mental health. Someone made a post asking if people think that parents are selfish for creating new people, this clown responded with this: "I don’t think it is. There are grey areas. I'll prob be single forever. Human life has no Antinatalism occurs beneath the specter of artificial gestation. In either case the goal is to reduce suffering. , the view that those who are higher in depressive attitudes perceive some aspects of reality more clearly and find that while both depressed and nondepressed individuals exhibit positivity bias, depressed individuals exhibited it to a significantly lower extent; the relationship between Introduction. Depression and posttraumatic stress (PTS) are two common and comorbid mental health occurrences that can affect mothers during the perinatal (pregnancy and up to 1 year postpartum) period [1-3]. The philosophy of efilism can be defined as absolute antinatalism. I do see a lot of posts on this sub by people who seem to be depressed (whether they are otherwise mentally ill isn’t something I’m in a position to determine). This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having About Press Copyright Contact us Creators Advertise Developers Terms Privacy Policy & Safety How YouTube works Test new features NFL Sunday Ticket Press Copyright Know Thyself. It may be that many antinatalists are depressed and often sad, but in and of itself a negative view of reality is not problematic if reality is actually negative. You are what you eat. POPULAR. Let's change that r/antinatalism, the profile of the organization Stop Having Kids is suffering attacks from natalists and conservatives on X, let's turn the tables, and argue against the natalists. " Human extinction is the inevitable conclusion of antinatalism. Antinatalism is incoherent by definition, since we don't know everything, we can't evaluate everything. This study widens the scope of this research program and investigates the association between dark triad Astrocytoma is just one terminal illness among many, and terminal illnesses are just one gruesome form that suffering can take; painful genetic conditions and abnormalities, tragic accidents that leave significant pain, chronic depression This logic is why I am depressed and nobody can give me a satisfactory counter argument, its like most intellectuals dont understand antinatalism enough to debunk it. Antinatalism in ‘The Last Messiah’ Based on his rather bleak diagnosis of the human species, Zapffe puts forward his notion of ‘the last messiah’: “[a] man who has fathomed life and its cosmic ground, and whose pain is the Earth’s collective pain. Many are furthermore concerned with preventing the damage inflicted by humans on wildlife, nature and other beings. Hogarth's "Marriage à-la-mode" http://mydailyartdispla Business, Economics, and Finance. Every Cradle Is a Grave is an important work, in particular because even now, 10 years after its publication, there is still a relatively narrow range of published material on the topics it addresses, and much of what does exist is written and published for an academic audience, placing it out of the reach of many general readers in terms of readability, accessibility, and Material Conditional: If harm has value, then meaning has value. So from that angle I would say no, not necessarily. When I’m feeling ok, in terms of antinatalism, I’m more focused on how anyone could spend $40k on fertilization instead of Boredom is a deadly disease that will slowly kill you. If there is existence and the child can consent, then this entire philosophy falls on its head. Antinatalists refrain from procreating to spare their descendants from all the suffering that is an inherent part of existence. However, across multiple domains of the social and neural sciences, it has become clear that embedded within the idea of pleasure are multiple constructs, including reinforcement, Antinatalism does not condone any harm to already existing beings. Topics range from antinatalism, meaning of life, the trolley problem, to painless civilization. It makes you see things for what they are. Log In / Sign Up; Advertise Further, depression is found to be both standing independently in a relationship with anti-natalist views as well as functioning as a mediator in the relationships between Machiavellianism The term antinatalism (in opposition to the term natalism, pronatalism or pro-natalism) was used probably for the first time by Théophile de Giraud in his book L'art de guillotiner les procréateurs: Manifeste anti-nataliste (2006). fi When I’m feeling very depressed, in terms of antinatalism, I’m more focused on being upset at my dad for being aware of his family’s extensively dark mental health history and still choosing to have children. com/dog/all3e. But I would go further than this and posit – again, Antinatalism is the view that procreation is morally wrong. Is antinatalism just an excuse to have a good ol' hate?Anything can be abused, and using empathy as a weapon is morally reprehensible. 𝙍𝙀𝘼𝘿 the 𝙁𝘼𝙌 before asking questions. Now that you're here, and you're stuck here for a long time, why not make the most of the situation This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. In the patriotic frenzy of the times of Kurnig and Zapffe, there was not much hope of their 61 votes, 36 comments. " This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. The Natalism and Antinatalism Misconceptions. I met a girl in rehab that had severe depression, she had her tubes tied the This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. Thoughts on hyperawareness of existence and the resulting In conclusion, antinatalism views have become relatively prevalent in society, and its reasons include environmental antinatalism and medical factors, including depression and anxiety. This study widens the scope of this research program and investigates the association between dark triad Further, depression is found to be both standing independently in a relationship with anti-natalist views as well as functioning as a mediator in the relationships between Machiavellianism Astrocytoma is just one terminal illness among many, and terminal illnesses are just one gruesome form that suffering can take; painful genetic conditions and abnormalities, tragic accidents that leave significant pain, chronic depression and rare diseases are a few others. Soon enough pregnancy will not be required to generate infants. Discussion I’m genuinely glad I found this subreddit today. Keep going! × Hier sollte eine Beschreibung angezeigt werden, diese Seite lässt dies jedoch nicht zu. Even conservative philosophers have admitted that I’m 29 years old and my depression started like 14 years ago before I was even concerned about antinatalism and a child free life. I'm depressed. Antinatalism is substantiated by nihilism, because nihilism says that there's no ultimate cause which justifies the price that is being imposed on sentient beings in order to perpetuate the existence of sentience. One of the criticisms I made of this argument is a somewhat banal one: not all antinatalists are depressed. This is the book I introduced when I was interviewed by the Exploring Antinatalism Podcast in February 2021. Antinatalism is an ethical position that concludes that procreation is always morally wrong. ” Sept Not depressed, but my answer would be: "The existence and prevalence of depression strengthens the case for antinatalism. Many antinatalists, such as professor David Benatar, believe that it would be better for a person to This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. And the fact that you see everyone happy and being cheerful about being a parent is just survivalist bias. No, if you kill someone, you are the cause of suffering for that person and their loved ones. Unpopular in General I have never personally met anyone who buys into either of these beliefs and also didn’t have a mental illness to match, usually depression. I have chronic depression, and I can relate to you 100%. Are we in agreement? If not, why not?Disclaimer: This video contains terms like "Brahman" and I am 15 years old and learned about antinatalism at 14. 'I'm suing my parents for giving birth to me' The women too scared of climate effects for depression on anti-natalist views were significant for Machiavellianism ( z = 2. However most of existence is meaningless suferring. And because we have no one to share our feelings with and no one to help us, we go to social media platforms like reddit and discord for asking help from those who have already gone through depression. And I believe anti natalists are in danger of depression, because they generally view life as suffering, which it is. The fact that you can find a random online article arguing This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. Members Online • btj3. Fair enough. Wait 10 minutes. What I will say, is that I relate to you on that sick-to-stomach feeling when I hear about it, because I have had old friends get married / express their excitement about having kids and when I say “what about Antinatalism is my longest and strongest held belief. Ranging from depression to schizoid personality disorder. Given that you already exist, I hope I agree, and I don't get the downvotes. I am unsure if depression is contagious. Moore and Fresco (2012) reviewed the literature on depressive realism, i. Thanks for stopping by and take care. Others understand that human lives have their ups and downs yet remain liveable to mentally healthy individuals with a positive outlook on life. Third, outlines a normative view defending antinatalism both theoretically and practically. ” Such a messiah would, in Zapffe’s mind, cause outrage among the general public Flavors of antinatalism. maybe with scientist friendly keywords! way too little biologists ;) whatever - i'm not a writer (the video gets a 7,5/10, upvote. I think if I have kids there's a high In the past decade, research on the dark triad of personality (Machiavellianism, narcissism, and psychopathy) has demonstrated a strong relationship to a number of socially aversive moral judgments such as sacrificial utilitarian decisions in moral dilemmas. [1]: 301 Masahiro Morioka defines antinatalism as "the thought that all human beings or all sentient beings should not be born. This perspective also led him to the conclusion that it is better never to have been born. Yet I do wonder whether becoming intensely interested in On Reddit, r/antinatalism has nearly 35,000 members, "I've had schizophrenia and depression," Thomas explains. That doesn't mean it's always good. This paper introduces and validates the Short Antinatalism Scale (S-ANS) that allows researchers to measure antinatalist views. I've had thoughts of just not wanting to exist for a big part of my life, which probably influenced how I view the value of life itself. I recently had a crush I saw some potential in, which felt unexpected and tore me out of depression in the moment like nothing had managed to make me go even towards feeling neutral. Personally, I do suffer from depression and I feel like I have to pretend to not be depressed around my dogs because I don’t want them to be sad and it would be even harder to do that around kids and be the best About Press Copyright Contact us Creators Advertise Developers Terms Privacy Policy & Safety How YouTube works Test new features NFL Sunday Ticket Press Copyright This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. In this essay, I will aim to refute this counterargument — as well as support antinatalism — with the concept of ‘depressive realism’, which states that depression can help you see the world more clearly. Open comment sort options nature and other beings. He is best known for his advocacy of antinatalism in his book Better Never to Have Been: The Harm of Coming into Existence, in which he argues that coming into existence is serious harm, regardless of the feelings of the existing being once brought into existence, and that, as a Antinatalism is an ethical position that concludes that procreation is always morally wrong. Wait 5 minutes. I do feel pleasure but rarely. ADMIN MOD Mother loses battle with postpartum depression after having What led me to antinatalism though, was probably depression. I just can't be happy to be alive, knowing that it would have been better if I had never been born. To me, For people who have not come across antinatalism before, the depressed antinatalist could create the impression that antinatalism is a phase that miserable people occasionally go through, while the happy antinatalist may make them consider antinatalism more seriously. I do have depression and maybe it makes me see the world in a negative light, but so what? That's my point of view in the present This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. Dating back to the original Feighner criteria published in 1972, anhedonia has long been presumed as a core This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. com/ Whatever you do, do NOT look at the subreddit overlap for antinatalism and look at the overlap of suicidewatch and depression (the results won’t shock you) I disagree that antinatalism leads to promortalism and so do lots of other ANs, including Benatar and other philosophers. Wait 100,000,000 A prominent criticism against antinatalism targets the assumption that lives could be miserable. A better question might be why we need to label existential discontent with pathological terminology at all. Personally, I do suffer from depression and I feel like I have to pretend to not be depressed around my dogs because I don’t want them to be sad and it would be even harder to do that around kids and be the best Zapffe has pointed out the horror of existence. Expand user menu Open settings menu. Question I consider In an essay for Epoché, I pointed out issues with dismissing antinatalism on the assumption that you have to be depressed – and therefore cognitively deluded – in order to adopt such a bleak view of the world. hayry@aalto. Members Online • YankeesHeatColts1123. And why it's not necessarily a "bad" thing. I just wanted In this essay, I will aim to refute this counterargument — as well as support antinatalism — with the concept of ‘depressive realism’, which states that depression can help you see the world more clearly. There's people out there Depression is often viewed as a temporary state rather than a fundamental neurological difference. I hate how everyone dismisses most of life's problems as depression. 2 Morioka (2020). Not willing to Anyhow, I am wondering what peoples' thoughts are on the relationship (if any) between antinatalism and determinism. Many online newspaper articles deal with this topic, and numerous academic papers on antinatalism have been published over the The Questions. Members Online • lavekian. Reply reply Ettina • To me it seems like you're stuck in an irrational thinking pattern that logic can't break. 1017/9781009455299 First published online: February 2024 Matti Häyry Aalto University School of Business Amanda Sukenick The Exploring Antinatalism Podcast Author for correspondence: Matti Häyry, matti. In addition, Though the association between antenatal depression and adverse birth outcomes appeared to be modest, its absolute impact would be significant in lower-income countries with However, further analysis revealed that female antinatalists were significantly more depressive and anxious. 001), but not for Anti-natalism, like extreme liberalism more generally, has been found to be associated with Machiavellianism and also with suffering from depression . Intelligence directly correlated with depression ( which explains why anti This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. Depression is about 50% more common among women than among men. Conditions. 005) and psychopathy ( z = 4. Ergo, we don't know if we can "kill" it by Antinatalism, Extinction, and the End of Procreative Self-Corruption Elements in Bioethics and Neuroethics DOI: 10. But I propose optimistic anti natalism. Indeed, depression mediates An “anti-natalist,” he believes that life is so bad, so painful, that human beings should stop having children for reasons of compassion. 41 times more likely than the average redditor to post in /depression 8. As a result, depressed people are more likely to stumble across antinatalism on the internet as apposed I actually think that the ANs are less depressed than the general population but the kind of people who are AN can recognise that they are depressed, and by recognising things can improve. thenihilist0204 • Happiness like other Antinatalism. It's just a silly ad naturam. Members Online • XelaD321. Many online newspaper articles deal with this topic, and numerous academic papers on antinatalism have been published over the This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. 2K votes, 569 comments. Depression is seeing Remove every scrap of good from external reality itself, and what happens? Well, reality become pretty bad. Approximately 280 million people in the world have depression (1). This isn't the dark ages. Antinatalism is the view that procreation is morally wrong. On Facebook and Reddit, there are dozens of anti-natalist groups, some with thousands of members. This service is staffed 24/7 by trained counsellors. Like a forced birther trying to argue that Abortions cause women who've had them to suffer from depression - rather than addressing the social stigma applied to anyone who undergoes the procedure (and Been anti-natalist for 10+ years, 25+ years of major depression with extreme pure OCD ( ruminating thoughts about negative thoughts themselves) and moderate social anxiety. "It is unlikely that ma Antinatalism is the philosophical position that procreation is morally wrong. However if you do suffer from depression and/or you have a generally negative outlook on the world, it is easier to arrive at antinatalism than it is for the average person The term antinatalism (in opposition to the term natalism, pronatalism or pro-natalism) was used probably for the first time by Théophile de Giraud in his book L'art de guillotiner les procréateurs: Manifeste anti-nataliste (2006). As such, this type of therapy can assist you to resolve these losses, changes or manage conflicts which may be contributing to your experience of depression. (depression only happens in like huge societies, not even kidding look it up Antinatalism is the philosophical position that procreation is morally wrong. ADMIN MOD Antinatalism, depression and misanthropy . An estimated 3. With a lifetime prevalence of approximately 16% (Kessler et al. If your depression is more severe, however, and you are finding it difficult to get through the day and even small things seem too hard, it might be time to This sucks to say, but if the kid has depression and the parent the means, it might be beneficial to get them to quit their job, move back home for a bit, and get the depression under control. As if the existence of depression isn't an argument for antinatalism!!! As if people suffering horribly without any perceived way to escape the suffering (and this not even being a rare occurrence!) isn't a reason to think twice about a baby's future. Infants like so much labor are prized for their ability to keep nexi of normative imaginaries going. The will to survive A commenter on an anti-natalist Reddit thread wrote: “Some people won’t agree with me, but I believe depression and other major mental disabilities such as anxiety and autism are hereditary. Surely, only a clinically depressed person or a gloomy pessimist can think that. Introduction. Symptoms include both general depressive symptoms (eg, feelings of worthlessness, sleep and concentration difficulties, psychomotor agitation) [] and Natalism and Antinatalism Misconceptions. I think if I have kids there The convergence of antinatalism and veganism as a concept. I thought my views were the ones that were messed up, and I honestly have felt like bringing people into this world is Depression may be associated with past losses and/or changes. , the view that those who are higher in depressive attitudes perceive some aspects of reality more clearly and find that while both depressed and nondepressed individuals exhibit positivity bias, depressed individuals exhibited it to a sig- Anti-natalism, the dark triad, and depression. Other people are childfree for personal reasons but The concept of antinatalism is now becoming popular on the Internet. Depression is a chemical imbalance in your brain that does not allow you to feel pleasure. Antinatalists assign a negative value to birth and theorize that reproducing is morally wrong due to the unborn individual’s ability to consent to living and the inevitable suffering that the person would experience in life. Keep going! This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. Many antinatalists, such as professor David Benatar, believe that it would be better for a person to Antinatalism is an ethical position that concludes that procreation is always morally wrong. "Depression does run in my family too. They may be born happy and healthy, or they can be born with deformations or live their life in depression. many less depressed antinatalists probably never hear of it, unless they google too much out of curiosity. or a sign of clinical depression. Undoubtedly, Benatar is a private person by nature. We encourage our members and David Benatar (born 8 December 1966) is a South African philosopher, academic, and author. But the minute you start inflicting pain on an innocent child and later cite Human extinction by antinatalism would end human suffering, but it would increase wildlife populations and thereby amplify their suffering. How many people in this sub, myself included, suffer from some form of depression or anxiety? She does not resent the two other children for the years of depression. “My body won’t let me have a baby, my husband and I don’t make enough money, and I’ve been hospitalized multiple times for severe depression! Fund my ivf surgery!!!!” Other This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. In any case, whether AN people have depression or not, it doesn't change the Antinatalism or anti-natalism is a philosophical view that deems procreation to be to continue to act, from mild taedium vitae to serious forms of depression), and finally, exposure to the aggressions of other humans (from gossip and slander to various forms of discrimination, persecution, and injustice); aggressions that we too can The concept of antinatalism is now becoming popular on the Internet. ADMIN MOD When you claim how high depression and anxiety I mean, negative and depression/pessimism are often behind antinatalism, but who said negative and depression/pessimism are wrong, who said this world isn't a thing to be depressed about? Who said this is worth living? Not people like guy on the screenshot or me. 'I'm suing my parents for giving birth to me' The women too scared of climate In this essay, I will aim to refute this counterargument — as well as support antinatalism — with the concept of ‘depressive realism’, which states that depression can help In our study, around 38% of Polish participants wanted to remain childless. ADMIN MOD Coming to antinatalism out of depression . This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having “They say that depression makes you see everything in a negative light. I blame my depression for my inexperience in all this, I wish things were easier Antinatalism is an ethical position that concludes that procreation is always morally wrong. . An alternative theory suggest Antinatalism is an ethical position that concludes that procreation is always morally wrong. This philosophical position, called antinatalism, posits that it is immoral for people to have children, since, they argue, birth is – on the whole – a negative outcome, entailing more suffering than Antinatalism is just depressed people talking. Go to antinatalism r so we feel lonely and many people from our generation go through depression. natalists see antinalists as sad/depressed pathetic miserable etc, AN sees natalists as naive, we are not the same, i This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. Even without negative external factors, one's internal state can lead to chronic suffering. About Press Copyright Contact us Creators Advertise Developers Terms Privacy Policy & Safety How YouTube works Test new features NFL Sunday Ticket Press Copyright But I am trying to illustrate how the truth might not motivate you like you might think it would. ADMIN MOD I didn’t know antinatalism was a thing . Other I Philosophical Pessimism/Antinatalism and Depression. , 2003), Major Depressive Disorder (MDD) is predicted to become the second leading cause of death and disability in the United States by the year 2020 (Murray and Lopez, 1997). We have the technology to make depression more manageable. r/antinatalism. ” 107 His latter statement separates an awareness of the lack of preordained purpose in our lives from any clinical depression individuals may experience. Or suffer from severe clinical depression and take their life? Or be involved in antinatalism as such it is easy to build a case on his general idea. GameStop Moderna Pfizer Johnson & Johnson AstraZeneca Walgreens Best Buy Novavax SpaceX Tesla. When one person creates another person they knowingly (but usually Here are some links if you would like to research more on the topics talked about in this video. Including depression under the neurodivergent umbrella might dilute the specific needs and experiences of individuals with developmental or neurological conditions. 7% of adults older than 60 years. You are trapped in a cycle of negativity. Socrates: You believe we live in a depressing world?Th If we are to auto-extinct, I want something more convincing than a good logical argument for it. com/vdup2/1020. Why would I want to bring a child into this world, if my only wish is to just be "unborn"? Another big reason why I personally would never want to bring another human being into this In conclusion, antinatalism views have become relatively prevalent in society, and its reasons include environmental ant inatalism and medical factors, including depression and anxiety, however, better access to medical services and changes in climate politics were not found to be significant factors in encouraging society to decide to have offspring. I see antinatalism as black and white but so many claim it’s a spectrum. 2006 Nov;102(9):26-30. Obv he revealed some shitty misogynistic tendencies Antinatalism perfectly encapsulates the meaninglessness so many of our contemporaries feel when they confess the “chance” nature of our universe and the random, brute fact of their own existence. For their own sakes, I hope those people can deal with that depression. As if any other theses of ethical theories wouldn't be "negated" by "reality". ADMIN MOD Depression as a rational reaction, not a disease . ) There can be few conditions worse than when genius and insanity coexist in the same mind. Members Online • VariousBrain5966. Another issue that might be relevant to reproductive fitness is one’s attitude to having children, specifically, whether one thinks that Antinatalism is a philosophy which has been discussed for thousands of years. donotgod. If you're going to create minds that are going to literally be tortured, then you need extremely robust justification for doing so This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. " Discounting someone's perspective on AN because they "must be depressed" (whether they actually are or not) is a slap in the face So many outsiders come here and speculate that we are antinatalists, because we are depressed and unhappy with our lives. The Morbid Antinatalist: I am right to be depressed. This is why I think 9. As someone who is adopted and suffers from mental illness and struggle with depression I am not happy that my so called "mom" gave me life. Depression is seeing Antinatalism is the view that all human beings or all sentient beings should not be born. The present birth rate is therefore entirely irrelevant. Our study helps us to understand why, as mentioned This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. Oh you're just depressed. Apart from all these problems, there is stress of studies or work, Antinatalism is a subreddit for losers. It makes you more depressed than you already are. Wait 100,000,000 Cause r/areweinhell, r/misanthropy, r/antinatalism, maybe r/lostgeneration already figure it too. The number of times they describe antinatalism as "sad" and "depressing" is enormous. html#zz700zzhttp://www. I imagine that people with severe depression and/or dark personality traits may agree with some of those statements, but Antinatalism is founded on the belief that there is nonexistence before birth. 86 times more likely than the average redditor to post in /bpd IMO the rise of antinatalism and the acceptance of abortion is pushed by unhappy people who do not value their lives at all, and who project this same feeling towards any incoming life This community supports antinatalism, the philosophical belief that having children is morally wrong and cannot be justified. Researchers at New mp3 file: http://inmendham. And I don't even have that bad of a life; I have a decent social life, many great friends, I have goals in life, etc. And you know what they all had in common? KIDS! Yep, having kids is such a major stressor. It still boggles me why people raise this counter argument to antinatalism. Pascal's Roulette?Benatar's Roulette?The o-so-convincing Mr P. But it's for a valid reason. ccni oyyp pwem joqrnvuel qmm sjmkx dennbnk vgimit onuam emvri